Profile of an Unbundled Learning Ecosystem: New Hampshire

The podcast episode “New Hampshire Unbundled” explores how New Hampshire has become a leader in unbundled and competency-based learning, offering students personalized educational pathways that extend beyond traditional school environments. By embracing initiatives like the Virtual Learning Academy Charter School (VLACS) and Learn Everywhere, the state provides learners with opportunities to earn credits through real-world experiences, ranging from internships to independent projects, thus fostering a learning ecosystem that is adaptable to individual student needs and aspirations. The discussion highlights the importance of flexible learning models that prioritize student engagement and mastery over seat time, and it emphasizes the critical role of policy and technology in expanding access to diverse educational opportunities. Through these innovative approaches, New Hampshire is paving the way for a future-ready education system that prepares students for success in an ever-evolving world.

Outline

• ​​(00:00) Introduction to Unbundled Learning
• (03:17) Personal Stories of Impactful Learning
• (06:39) Innovative Education Policies in New Hampshire
• (21:02) Opportunities for Growth and Education Reform
• (23:12) Challenges and Barriers to Educational Innovation
• (30:21) Future Directions and Student-Centered Approaches

Introduction to Unbundled Learning

Nate McClennen: Hello, everyone. You’re listening to the Getting Smart Podcast, and I am Nate McLennen. Today, we are focused on unbundled learning, the third in a three-part series, where we talk to folks in different states—Colorado first, then Arizona second, and today, we’re in our last installment with New Hampshire.

We’re really thinking about how students can learn outside of the normal constraints of a classroom or a typical school. What are the different policies and schools that have started to work and make these things a reality?

In the last podcast, I talked about grain size and unbundling—unbundling at the curriculum level, the course level, the school level, and then at the ecosystem level. How do people learn outside in different organizations and then restack that into a cohesive learning experience?

I know that’s happening in New Hampshire. Today, I want to present a different context for this, using a matrix. Imagine, from left to right, moving from bundled to unbundled, and from bottom to top, moving from in-system to out-of-system. In the bottom-left corner, we have bundled and in-system. Most schools and most learning organizations provide structured learning experiences that are coordinated and designed by the school and happen within the school.

As we move to the right, still in-system but more unbundled, we see more personalized learning experiences. There’s more choice, but these experiences are still within the constraints of the system.

In the upper-left corner, we see ecosystem-level work happening. This includes multiple providers outside of the school that offer options for students but are still bundled—for example, CTE courses, internships, and apprenticeships that are formally established by the school.

Finally, in the upper-right corner, we have unbundled ecosystems that are completely out-of-system. This is what we’re going to talk about today—a network or marketplace where students can pick and choose what they’re interested in, and those experiences stack and count for credit in various ways.

So, what’s the goal? The goal is to ensure that every learner meets the expected or required outcomes, depending on whether they’re in the public or non-public sectors, in a manner where they’re challenged with relevant experiences and feel like they belong. This enables them to reach their full potential—professionally, civically, and personally.

Since the early 2000s—and maybe even earlier—New Hampshire has led the way in building tools, policies, and practices that push toward this upper-right corner, creating a learning ecosystem that is highly personalized and unbundled, offering diverse options for all students.

Today, we’re joined by Steve Kossakoski, CEO of Virtual Learning Academy Charter School (VLACS), which he has led for the past 16 years. We’re also joined by Frank Edelblut, Commissioner of the New Hampshire Department of Education since 2017. Frank, I read somewhere that you have one of the longest tenures for commissioners anywhere in the country. I don’t know if that’s still true, but congratulations on that—I hope it’s a good thing.

Frank Edelblut: Happy to be here and joining my colleague, Steve. It sounds like we’re going to have a fun conversation.

Steve Kossakoski: Yeah, thanks for the invitation. Glad to be here.

Nate McClennen: Excellent. And thank you both for your time.

Personal Stories of Impactful Learning

Nate McClennen: So I start off with the same question in most podcasts, and I say it’s the Twitter version because some of these stories can go on for a long time. I love asking our podcast guests: What was your most impactful learning experience during the K-12 years that was outside of school? By impactful, I mean you were highly engaged and learned a lot. So, Steve, I’m going to challenge you with this question. What do you remember?

Steve Kossakoski: I remember my junior year in high school. My friend Jim and I decided to build a hang glider. We had no money, so we used tree saplings and polyethylene. It was so heavy it didn’t work going down a hill, so we pulled it behind a snowmobile—and I almost killed my friend. Not that he got injured, but he went straight up in the air and straight down.

But we learned a lot of things trying to put that together and trying to make it work.

Nate McClennen: Did you have multiple attempts at this, or was one attempt good enough for you to learn that it wasn’t working? How persistent were you?

Steve Kossakoski: Just one attempt because, as I said, it was made out of elastic bands and duct tape and all kinds of things. He went up about 20 feet or so and then crashed down. It was in shambles by the time it was over, but it flew. I have pictures.

Nate McClennen: Frank, it’s a hard one to beat, but what do you have for us?

Frank Edelblut: That is a hard one to beat. Actually, I’m going to jump in with two quick ones to keep my time short. Steve, you shared that, and I had a similar experience. My brother and I built a boat—a hydroplane. He drove it out on the water and came back, and it worked fine.

Then I hopped in. At the time, I actually had a full leg cast on. I went out from the shore, was speeding along, and was getting ready to turn around. My brother was on the shore jumping up and down, screaming something, but I couldn’t hear him. I turned the opposite direction he wanted me to and capsized the boat because the side was falling off. It quickly sank.

But mine’s kind of an inside-outside school experience. I had the unique opportunity to attend four different high schools in four different states—New Jersey, Missouri, Connecticut, and Pennsylvania. While this was technically inside school, it felt outside each time because I was constantly adapting to new environments.

When people hear that, they often say, “Oh my gosh, it must’ve been so difficult.” But I say it was a great experience. I met tons of people, came from a large family, and would not have given it up. I got to meet many different kinds of people from different parts of the country.

Nate McClennen: Yeah, you think about all the competencies you had to learn around interacting with new people, recreating friendships, relearning teachers and school systems. Kudos to that. So, hang gliders, hydroplanes, and four high schools in four years—I can’t top that.

What I’ll share today is similar to your hang glider and hydroplane stories. We lived near a small creek, and inevitably, we tried to build rafts. I have a distinct memory—probably in late elementary school, fourth or fifth grade—of spending a long time building a raft. We put it in the water, got on it, and it immediately sank to the bottom.

It’s funny what sticks in our brains. We forget so much as we get older, but some experiences stay vivid. I appreciate you both sharing those.

Innovative Education Policies in New Hampshire

Nate McClennen: Let’s dive into the heart of this conversation. I’d like to start with the challenges you were trying to solve. You both come at this from different angles. Steve, you’ve been in education for a long time and run a school, while Frank, you came into education later in life. Yet, you’re both making interesting things happen. What challenges were you trying to address? Frank, let’s start with you, then we’ll go to Steve.

Frank Edelblut: That’s a big question, but I’ll start here. You mentioned earlier, “Can students learn outside of school?” My premise has always been that students are learning outside of school. They’re learning all the time, especially once they leave the building.

So, the question for us as educators is: How do we tap into that? How do we nurture that learning instead of confining it to specific hours and places? Learning isn’t limited to 7:30 to 2:30 in a specific building—it’s ongoing and continuous.

Nate McClennen: I love that idea. I’ve always said that there’s only a small fraction of learning that happens in school, and it’s the fraction we happen to count. That’s the part that shows up on the report card. But there’s no doubt that humans are learning all the time.

Frank Edelblut: Exactly.

Nate McClennen: Steve, what about you? You’ve been in schools for a long time and started VLACS. What was the impetus?

Steve Kossakoski: I was lucky to work for a very innovative superintendent. We had started the first district-based charter school, and he asked me if I thought the technology had matured enough to support a virtual school. I said yes, and he gave me the time to do the design work and start the school.

The whole premise was based on my 30+ years in education at the time—now well into 40. Something everybody knows but doesn’t always acknowledge is that not every student learns the same way or at the same pace. But our systems are set up to treat every kid the same and expect everyone to arrive at the finish line at the same time.

Learning has to be ongoing and happen in many places. Saying it only exists in a school isn’t enough anymore. That’s not a criticism of traditional schools—they’re doing incredible work. But they’re often bound by bureaucracy, tradition, and the sheer difficulty of making changes.

What we’ve tried to do is allow students to customize their learning based on their needs, interests, and talents.

Nate McClennen: Steve, you mentioned that traditional schools are often constrained by their systems, and I’d love to dig deeper into how VLACS addresses that. What makes your model different?

Steve Kossakoski: At VLACS, everything revolves around the idea of competency-based learning. We ask, “What does the student need to know and be able to do?” It’s not about seat time or how long they’ve been in a course; it’s about demonstrating mastery.

This approach allows students to move at their own pace. If they already know the material, they can demonstrate their understanding and move on. If they need more time, they can take it. It’s incredibly flexible.

We also allow students to choose how they want to learn. Some might prefer traditional courses, while others thrive in project-based learning, internships, or experiential activities. For example, if a student wants to learn about environmental science, they might take a course or work on a project with a local conservation organization.

Our goal is to meet students where they are and provide a variety of options to help them succeed.

Frank Edelblut: What Steve described is critical because it shifts the focus from “How do we teach?” to “How do students learn?” The traditional education model is largely teacher-driven, but competency-based learning flips that. It centers on the student and their individual needs.

In New Hampshire, we’ve embraced this at a policy level. We were the first state to eliminate the Carnegie unit as a requirement for high school graduation. Instead, students must demonstrate competency in specific areas. This gives schools the flexibility to design personalized pathways for students.

Nate McClennen: Frank, can you give an example of how this plays out in practice? How do schools design these pathways?

Frank Edelblut: Sure. Take something like a traditional science course. In a typical high school, students might spend a year in a biology class, going through the same textbook and labs as everyone else.

In a competency-based model, a student could meet the biology requirement in multiple ways. They might take a traditional course, or they might participate in an internship at a local hospital, work on a research project, or even take an online class.

The key is that they demonstrate their understanding of the core competencies, regardless of how they learned them.

Steve Kossakoski: I’d add that this approach empowers students. When they have choices about how they learn, they’re more engaged. And when they’re engaged, they’re more likely to succeed.

Opportunities for Growth and Education Reform

Nate McClennen: Let’s talk about the role of technology. Steve, VLACS is obviously a tech-enabled model. How does technology support unbundled learning?

Steve Kossakoski: Technology is a game-changer because it removes many of the traditional barriers to learning. With our online platform, students can access courses and resources anytime, anywhere. They’re not limited by geography or a school’s schedule.

Technology also allows us to provide a personalized experience. For example, we use data to track student progress and identify areas where they might need extra support. Teachers can then step in and provide targeted assistance.

Another important aspect is the ability to connect students with real-world experiences. Through our platform, they can find internships, mentorships, and project-based opportunities that align with their interests and goals.

Frank Edelblut: Technology also expands access. One of our challenges in New Hampshire is that we’re a rural state. Many students don’t have access to the same resources as their peers in more urban areas.

With technology, we can bring those resources to them. Whether it’s a specialized course, a virtual field trip, or a connection with an expert in another part of the state—or even the world—technology makes it possible.

Nate McClennen: I love that you both mentioned access and personalization. These are two of the biggest benefits of technology, but they also come with challenges. How do you ensure that all students can take advantage of these opportunities, especially those who might not have reliable internet or devices?

Frank Edelblut: That’s a great question. During the pandemic, we saw firsthand how critical it is to address the digital divide. We worked with internet providers to expand access and distributed thousands of devices to students across the state.

But it’s not just about hardware and connectivity. We also need to provide training and support for students, families, and educators to ensure they can use these tools effectively.

Steve Kossakoski: I agree. At VLACS, we spend a lot of time onboarding students and families to make sure they’re comfortable with our platform and understand how to navigate it. We also provide ongoing support, so if they run into issues, they know where to turn for help.

Challenges and Barriers to Educational Innovation

Nate McClennen: Let’s pivot to real-world learning. You’ve both mentioned internships, mentorships, and other experiential opportunities. How are these integrated into your systems, and what impact do they have on students?

Steve Kossakoski: Real-world learning is a huge part of what we do at VLACS. Students have the option to earn credit through internships, independent projects, and experiential learning activities.

For example, we had a student interested in marine biology. Instead of taking a traditional course, they worked with a local aquarium and a marine research organization. They logged hours on research boats, learned about marine ecosystems, and completed a project that demonstrated their understanding of key competencies.

The beauty of this approach is that it connects academic learning to real-world applications. Students see the relevance of what they’re learning, and that motivates them to dig deeper.

Frank Edelblut: That’s exactly the kind of engagement we’re trying to foster across New Hampshire. One of our initiatives is the Learn Everywhere program, which allows students to earn high school credit for learning experiences outside of the traditional classroom.

This could be through a dance studio, a coding bootcamp, a music program, or even a job. The key is that the experience aligns with specific competencies and is evaluated to ensure quality.

One example is a student who wanted to learn auto mechanics. They worked at a local garage and gained hands-on experience while demonstrating the competencies needed for a high school credit in automotive technology.

Nate McClennen: That’s fascinating. How do you manage the evaluation piece? Who determines whether a student has met the required competencies?

Frank Edelblut: For Learn Everywhere, we have a rigorous approval process for providers. They submit their program, outlining the competencies they cover and how students will demonstrate mastery. Once approved, the provider becomes an official partner, and students can earn credit through their programs.

This system ensures quality while giving students the flexibility to pursue their passions.

Steve Kossakoski: At VLACS, we have a similar process. For internships and projects, students work with a certified teacher to set goals and identify the competencies they’ll focus on. The teacher evaluates their work based on evidence, which could include presentations, reports, or portfolio submissions.

This partnership between students, teachers, and external organizations is critical. It creates a support system that helps students succeed while maintaining high standards.

Future Directions and Sudent-Centered Approaches

Nate McClennen: What are the biggest barriers to scaling these models? You’re doing incredible work, but what’s holding back broader adoption?

Frank Edelblut: One of the biggest barriers is mindset. Traditional education systems are deeply ingrained, and it’s hard for people to imagine doing things differently. There’s often a fear of change, especially when it comes to unbundling learning.

Another challenge is policy. Many states still have rigid requirements around seat time, graduation credits, and other traditional metrics. These policies limit flexibility and make it harder to implement innovative models like Learn Everywhere.

Steve Kossakoski: I’d add that scalability is a challenge. Models like VLACS work well because they’re highly personalized, but personalization takes time and resources. Scaling this kind of approach while maintaining quality requires significant investment in technology, training, and infrastructure.

Frank Edelblut: And let’s not forget funding. Traditional funding models are based on attendance and enrollment in physical schools. When you start talking about unbundling, the funding mechanisms need to adapt to follow the student and support their learning, regardless of where or how it happens.

Nate McClennen: Those are great points. I’ve also noticed that community buy-in is crucial. Parents, students, and educators need to understand and believe in these models for them to succeed. How do you build that support?

Frank Edelblut: Communication is key. We spend a lot of time talking to families, educators, and community leaders about the benefits of unbundled learning. We share success stories and data to show how these models can improve student outcomes.

Steve Kossakoski: I agree. Transparency is also important. Families need to understand how these systems work and how they can help their children succeed. At VLACS, we offer orientations, webinars, and one-on-one support to ensure families feel confident in their decision to enroll.

Looking to the Future

Nate McClennen: As we wrap up, I want to look ahead. What’s your vision for the future of education in New Hampshire, and what role do you see unbundled learning playing in it?

Frank Edelblut: My vision is that every student has access to a personalized learning pathway that meets their unique needs and interests. I see unbundled learning as a way to make that vision a reality.

We’re building a system where students are no longer confined by geography, time, or traditional school structures. Instead, they have the freedom to learn in ways that work best for them, supported by a robust network of providers and opportunities.

Steve Kossakoski: I couldn’t agree more. My hope is that we continue to expand access and remove barriers so that every student—regardless of their background—can benefit from personalized, competency-based learning.

Technology will play a big role in this, but so will partnerships between schools, families, and communities. It’s going to take a collective effort to create the kind of ecosystem we’re envisioning.

Nate McClennen: Thank you both for sharing your insights and the incredible work you’re doing in New Hampshire. It’s clear that you’re leading the way in reimagining education and providing students with meaningful, personalized learning experiences.

For our listeners, be sure to check out the resources in the show notes to learn more about VLACS, Learn Everywhere, and other initiatives we discussed today. Thanks for tuning in!

Frank Edelblut: Thank you, Nate.

Steve Kossakoski: Thanks for having us.

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Frank Edelblut

Frank Edelblut has served as the commissioner of the New Hampshire Department of Education since February of 2017, which makes him one of the longest serving commissioners in the country. That is saying something for someone who did not start their career anywhere near education.

Frank started his journey in life as a Certified Public Accountant with PricewaterhouseCoopers. He then served as the Chief Financial Officer for a small public company before taking the entrepreneurial plunge and started a business that he ran for 18 years before exiting to a French company. At the time, the company was operating in 22 countries around the world. 

With time on his hands, he started doing early stage investing and became a state legislator before starting his current role.

Frank serves and has served on a number of boards, including the University System of New Hampshire, Council for Chief State School Officers and the National Assessment Governing Board. 

Frank holds a Bachelor of Science degree from the University of Rhode Island and a master’s degree from the Holy Cross Greek Orthodox School of Theology. He has been married for 38 years, has seven children and seven grandchildren. He describes this as, “Killing it!” 

He wants to see an education system that actually serves all children.

Steve Kossakoski 

Steve Kossakoski is the Chief Executive Officer at Virtual Learning Academy Charter School based in Exeter, New Hampshire. Previously, Steve was the Nellie MAE Education Foundation Board of Directors at Nellie Mae Education Foundation

Links

• Watch the full video
• Partnership to Advance Youth Apprenticeship
• Learn Everywhere 
• New Hampshire Learning Initiative
• Portrait of a NH Learner
• Virtual Learning Academy Charter School